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Talk:Type
Colour Coding Colour coding anyone? (in other words, colouring the headers of Fire, Ice, Poison etc with their respective colours). Or does the statement at the end (this type is shown by the colour yellow) suffice? --bewnt 15:13, 11 December 2008 (UTC) : How about both? I'm sure it'll make it look more attractive. If it doesn't look right, we can alwasy change it. --Yonder 17:03, 11 December 2008 (UTC) ::Please use colors which are easyly recognizable on the given white background. Yellow is not! --Justme2 17:19, 11 December 2008 (UTC) ::: Ahh, apologies - I'm using the Gaming Monaco skin, which has a black background - so I didn't see any problems. However, when the new Dan-Ball themed skin rolls out, will it affect this page? --bewnt 00:56, 12 December 2008 (UTC) ::::Yellow would still be a problem for the Dan-Ball skin (yellow on beige=strained eyes) --Yonder 01:15, 12 December 2008 (UTC) Freeze An anonymous user has written on the Orbs page that freeze is reduced to 0.2s for normal bosses (i.e. exclusive of Castle Boss). * We need to verify this. * More importantly, we need to observe the amount of reduction on both freeze weapons, so that we can generalise it. For example, if the above is true and if Freeze Glove is reduced to 0.02s on bosses, then we can say that freeze effect is 20% on normal bosses. --bewnt 16:03, 27 December 2008 (UTC) First we need to check if the freeze time is reduced by precent, reduced by a certain value or simply changed to a certain value. Also we can use a camera that works at 50 FPS so we can actually measure the time instead of guessing. 09:16, May 10, 2010 (UTC) elemental weapon, magical weapon, and type physical ---- The following discussion has been started at the Shout Box. ---- :11:59 ... :12:05 ... Btw: We have to ban the term "elemental attack" in favour of "magical attack" (see Needle Glove) :12:31 Technically, "physical" = elemental, no? :12:31 ... Anyway "magical (1) :12:32 ... IGNORE ABOVE. Magical is not good because (1) confusion with Magic orb/Magician(2) no such element I don't know if you can call "physical" to be "elemental", because "physics" is not an element, like fire, water, thunder or poison. But anyway, we already used the term "elemental weapon" in the past, refering ONLY to weapons with type fire, water, thunder, poison and freeze, and we didn't count in "physical" here. We can't use this term anymore, because either any weapon is elemental (because every weapon has a type), or it's only refering to Fire, Water, Thunder, Poison and Freeze, which means we always forget the Needle Glove. That's why I wanted to use "magical" (definition somehow like: "A magical weapon has an additional magical attack which requires Magic Points (MP)."). I think it's easier to explain the people that the all orbs and staves are an exception to the magical weapons (because they use magic by default), as to tell them a "weapon with type physical" is an elemental weapon, but only if it has MP, which doesn't make much sense. The best would be to only use the term "weapon with magical attack". --Justme2 12:24, 9 January 2009 (UTC) : Quite a valid discussion if you ask me. I shall list the factors, for and against. : ELEMENTAL > MAGICAL :* In many RPGs I play there is "physical resistance" and "magical resistance". Grouping "physical" under "magical" would be confusing. :* As said, confusion with Magic (orb) or Magician. With these in play, technically speaking, "magical attack" would mean an attack executed by a Magician, or a Magician wielding a Magic. :* We can redefine "elemental" to include "physical". : MAGICAL > ELEMENTAL :* As said by me2, our past definition excludes "physical" from "elemental" :* Magical encompasses all weapons that require MP :I believe the bolded point above outweighs every other point. Therefore, we can agree to group all weapons that require MP under the category of "magical" weapons (which means Needle Glove is magical, Fire Sword is magical but Fire orb is NOT magical). Elemental will retain its definition: non-physical (which means Needle Glove is not elemental but Fire Sword and Fire orb are both elemental). --bewnt 12:42, 9 January 2009 (UTC) :: OK, I'm fine with it! :: You also have to see it like this: The needles from the Needle Glove do physical damage. But how do they get into the glove? That's magic(al)! --Justme2 13:00, 9 January 2009 (UTC) :::For acupuncturing the boxer's hand..? :P --Yonder 13:14, 9 January 2009 (UTC) List of weapons by type Hey, what would you think about categorizing the weapons and make the overview a bit more appealing to the eye? ;) are two suggestions --Majorlee 13:47, October 22, 2009 (UTC) 1st suggestion Physical * Gloves ** Glove ** Mach Punch 1 ** Needle Glove2 ** Sonic Punch 2 ** Mach Knuckle 3 * Swords ** Sword ** Iron Sword 1 ** Long Sword 2 ** Sabel 3 * Bows ** Bow ** Triple Shot 1 ** Double Arrow 1 ** Triple Arrow 2 ** Quad Arrow 2 ** Oct Arrow 2 ** Quint Shot 3 ** Double Iron Arrow 3 * Orbs ** Magic * Staves ** Staff ** Staff of Wood 1 ** Long Staff 1 ** Battle Staff 2 ** Long Wood Staff 3 * Guns ** Gun ** Handgun 1 ** Submachine-gun 1 ** Shotgun 1 ** Rifle 1 ** Bazooka 2 ** Beretta 3 ** Uzi 3 ** Remington 3 Thunder * Gloves ** Thunder Glove 1 ** Spark Glove 2 ** Thunder Knuckle 3 * Swords ** Thunder Sword 1 ** Lightsaber 2 ** Thunder Sabel 3 * Orbs ** Thunder 1 ** Thunder Storm 2 * Staves ** Staff of Thunder 1 ** Lightning Staff 2 ** Staff of Light 1 * Guns ** Homing Laser 2 Fire * Gloves ** Fire Glove 2 ** Fire Knuckle 3 * Swords ** Fire Sword 1 ** Flame Sword 2 ** Fire Sabel 3 * Bows ** Fire Arrow 1 ** Double Fire 3 * Orbs ** Explosion 1 ** Fire 1 ** Volcano 2 ** Delta Explosion 3 ** Fire Rise 3 * Staves ** Staff of Fire 2 * Guns ** Grenade 2 ** Laser Gun 2 Ice * Swords ** Ice Sword 1 ** Frozen Sword 2 * Orbs ** Ice 1 ** Blizzard 2 ** Icicle 3 * Staves ** Staff of Ice 1 Poison * Gloves ** Poison Glove 1 * Bows ** Poison Arrow 2 ** Double Poison 2 * Staves ** Staff of Poison 2 Freeze * Gloves ** Freeze Glove 2 * Orbs ** Freeze 2 * Staves ** Staff of Freeze 3 OR 2nd suggestion Wow, good job making those tables! Btw, I like the first one better, although the Physical section could be broken down into two columns since it's so long. --Yonder 20:17, October 22, 2009 (UTC) : thx. personally i like the 2nd solution better, but let's wait for a couple of other opinions. --Majorlee 20:01, October 25, 2009 (UTC) ::I like the second idea better, it's even better than the enemies table. If we use it, what should be done with the section "List of Compo Items by type"? It's included in the list but without the additional info. :::i changed it to the 2nd version. i put the info of the "List of Compo Items by type" into the other sections, so nothing is lost. --Majorlee 22:55, October 27, 2009 (UTC) :::: Wow, pretty impressive! I really like it! --Justme2 08:39, October 28, 2009 (UTC) Resistances and weaknesses i added a list with the enemies' resistances and weaknesses. i also added some notes regarding some of them but i'm not sure, if i got those strengths/weaknesses right. the following things have to be checked (and which were already discussed somewhere above but which have never been answered): * ice weakness: initial damage and slow time seem to be reduced, but how about the "slow effect", i.e. the percentage of which the enemies get slower. * freeze weakness: is there a rule which indicates how much the freeze time is reduced? the AT seems to be unaffected. --Majorlee 23:30, October 27, 2009 (UTC) Ice An Ice attack 'slows' the enemy, as we already know, but does this only affect speed or attack rate as well? -kuzthekillakan It only affects movement and attack rate. --Yonder 17:09, December 29, 2009 (UTC) Do Ice effects stack? Gamelover101 here... Check out my awesome SR Pet Maker! 02:22, June 3, 2011 (UTC) How much does the enemy is strong or weak to that? Should we add by how much in precents the enemy is strong or weak to an element? The problem is when an enemy is strong against something i dont know if its 100%, 50% or something else.--Necrodoom 15:42, May 21, 2010 (UTC) :there are two problems with that: :1. (this is maybe a minor problem) some people are always concerned with taking information out of the gamecode which are not given by the game itself. i for my part don't mind that (i'm doing it myself), but there could be people who don't like/want that... :2. the values in the gamecode are not very clear and differ from each other, because e.g. the values for the physical attacks are not given in % but in total values, i.e. if an enemy is strong against physical attacks with the value 10 then the physical damage it receives is just reduced by 10... :but otherwise i wouldn't mind to specify on the strengths/weaknesses.--Majorlee 17:26, May 21, 2010 (UTC) WHAT THE FCK. What is wrong with the Yellow Boss Box Eel? It does not exist in Beach 3. It is utter codswallop (my interpretation of British). 16:49, March 4, 2011 (UTC) I failed that day. Ivan247 03:22, March 5, 2011 (UTC) Spirits I'm wondering whether it's not misleading to put the Spirits into the table because it might imply to some people that they are only restricted to their respective type whereas they can be attached to any weapon. - Majorlee 00:24, February 21, 2012 (UTC) I think all you need is to add a note about it. :/ 02:00, February 21, 2012 (UTC) ::That sounds also good. Majorlee 02:30, February 21, 2012 (UTC) :::Done! Also, welcome back, Majorlee! Ivan247Talk Page 11:41, February 21, 2012 (UTC) :::Thx =) --Majorlee 13:13, February 22, 2012 (UTC) Details on Fire? I think being a wikia with a ton of facts we should be able to add detail to the most complex element on the game. Anyone know how fire exactly works? We know how poison work and even have it listed here while the other elements are pretty much common sense. If we know how fire works then we can pretty much do the math for any weapon. A few questions I think should be answered: 1. On average how many frames does it take for the fire attack to hit assuming the enemy didn't move and live through it? I highly doubt it hit every frame compare to poison. 2. Do the flames stack? If my weapon produce 5 flames and all of which are touching the enemy then do each flame get an attack or does the game see it as one fire based attack? I honestly can't tell if the number of flames even help or not as it may only be improving the frames/hit rate. Based on my current DPS charts there are level 1 fire type weapons that easily overpower anything else, even level 6 weapons. I am pretty sure either the DPS due to the frames per hit is off or the idea that flames stack up is wrong. Either way I can't make a working DPS chart until I learn how this element type works. 17:41, November 17, 2012 (UTC) 1. I THINK that fire has a 20% chance of dealing damage every frame upon contact. 2. Yes it stack. If there are 5 flames, all the 5 flames will do individual damage. I'm not really sure about the #1 so it might get corrected by someone else... Samuel17 (talk) 19:55, November 17, 2012 (UTC) : That would make sense and thanks for replying, nice to see someone else care for the meta game. I have a very slow computer and I notice that fire seem to also have a delay to it though I guess it would be unoticable to most computers. The delay if I were have to guess would be around 0.2s though like I said this is just a guess. I am really happy to know the flames stack as I have at least that part right. Now if only I could understand this dan-ball.jp/javagame/ranger/ranger.jar as this may have the physics written out for anyone to see. Of course you were guessing on #1 so what others may think about it would be nice. 20:17, November 19, 2012 (UTC) Another Firey Incident Since we now understand how the burn rate works now, should we include that in weapon and enemy data? For those who don't: The Fire Burn Rate is placed at the same array position as Poison/Freeze Time and Ice Slow % in the weapon/enemy data arrays in the code. This value (hereafter called X) can range from 0 to 1000, which corresponds to a (X/10)% chance of damaging characters/enemies each frame if X is not equal to 0. At X = 0 the attack acts like Physical attacks. And of course there must be something in the fire to actually deal damage. This rate cannot be improved by any means in canonical SR. Ivan247 Talk Page 16:21, February 12, 2016 (UTC) I would say so. It can be valuable information. Plus, it's a lot like poison damage, which is already on the wiki. ______TΣ 01:34, February 14, 2016 (UTC) Template created for use. Any suggestions for improvement? Here are some uses: *Direct rate entry: -> *Source code X value entry: -> Ivan247 Talk Page 12:44, February 19, 2016 (UTC) Next discussion: Someone included the expected damage of each fire attack. However the use of the "=" sign was confusing to me because the fire attacks deal highly variable damage. Should we change its expression, like using an "≈" sign or we just simply include the projectile lifespan of the projectiles? Ivan247 Talk Page 07:19, March 23, 2016 (UTC)